Nebulon-B Hangar

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Nebulon-B Hangar

The Saxman
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Post by The Saxman » Sun Aug 05, 2018 3:47 pm

This is a long shot, but does anyone happen to have or remember the screens I posted a LONG time ago (it might have been on the X-Wing Legacy forums) using the XWA Nebulon-B model to show just how unfeasible it actually is for the thing to carry fighters?

A debate about this has erupted on the X-Wing Miniatures board, and I'd love to use them to help make the point.

I could always extract the model to do it again, but I really, REALLY don't want to have to go through all of that effort again.

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Driftwood
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Post by Driftwood » Sun Aug 05, 2018 4:37 pm

I'll do you one better and make up a custom hangar using opt editor and the map editor to facilitate taking screenshots using the actual dimensions.

Provided you're not in a huge hurry.

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Post by The Saxman » Sun Aug 05, 2018 5:00 pm

It's not that big of a deal, and certainly doesn't require a full OPT. It can easily be done with just the 3D models, which is how I did it before.

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Kilroy
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Post by Kilroy » Sun Aug 05, 2018 10:50 pm

Not entirely relevant but few years ago I made an animation that was never completed featuring the Nebulon B hangar briefly at the start. I tried to scale it roughly based on the Empire Strikes Back ending. The rest of the animation is pretty garbage.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rSznDI0P8g

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Post by Phoenix Leader » Fri Aug 10, 2018 7:15 am

The Nebulon-B frigate from XWAU is hangarless and I totally agree with such choice. I doubt a hangar could carry more than 6 fighters.

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Post by keiranhalcyon7 » Fri Aug 10, 2018 7:26 am

Tell that to the mission designers of X-Wing tours 4 and 5.

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Post by Phoenix Leader » Fri Aug 10, 2018 8:39 am

According to Wookieepedia a Nebulon B frigate can carry up to 12 fighters (1 squadron) in Canon Star Wars and 24 fighters (2 squadrons) in Legends Star Wars.
The mission designers of X-Wing surely took the fighter capacity of the Nebulon B frigate from a source dated before 1993, so it's Legends Star Wars.
Just checked all the missions from battles 14 and 16 of the X-Wing Conversion 4.0. Battles 14 and 16 are respectively X-Wing tours 4 and 5.
In those missions the Nebulon B frigates always carry more than 6 fighters each, but there are only 2 missions where there are more than 24 TIE starfighters launched from a single Nebulon B frigate: 1b14m7xwc (28 fighters launched from FRG Serpent) and 1b14m8xwc (40 TIE Bombers launched from FRG Enforcer).
1b14m8xwc also has a bug in the arrival condition of T/A Eta. The mission designers probably didn't pay much attention to that mission.

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Post by Epsilon Eridani » Fri Aug 10, 2018 9:12 am

Phoenix Leader wrote:
Fri Aug 10, 2018 7:15 am
The Nebulon-B frigate from XWAU is hangarless and I totally agree with such choice. I doubt a hangar could carry more than 6 fighters.
Maybe a hangar "through" the Nebulon B frigate, a side to side hangar could carry those 12 fighters which are now Canon.
No hope for the Legends 24.

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Post by The Saxman » Fri Aug 10, 2018 11:37 am

I did VERY extensive testing, and wish I could find my old images. Even if you put them nose-to-tail the Nebulon-B is barely over two X-wings wide at the widest part of the upper hull. If you made a through-hangar you MIGHT be able to squeeze a dozen X-wings on, but with absolutely NO SPACE WHATSOEVER to operate or maintain them.

The ONLY thing I got to work was a two-level facility; an upper flight deck and a below-decks storage hangar. It could carry no more than six X-wings, which required having two permanently spotted on the flight deck at all times, you couldn't FIT more than two on the deck and have room for flight operations, and it barely provided enough space to maintain and maneuver the remaining four in the hangar. And this still required gutting a significant amount of vital internal space.

It's very literally not worth the sacrifices in internal volume.

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Post by Phoenix Leader » Fri Aug 10, 2018 12:32 pm

Does the Nebulon-B frigate from Empire at War have the hangar?

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Post by Epsilon Eridani » Fri Aug 10, 2018 12:53 pm

In Empire at War the Nebulon-B frigate is only available for the Alliance, and rebel starships never carry fighters in that game, so a hangar would be useless.

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Post by Bman » Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:19 am

Probably not cannon, but I think I remember in one of the Jedi Knight games (Jedi Outcast), wasn't there a mission where the hangar of a Nebulon-B had a basement hangar, and you had to confront pirates who hijacked the ship? The hangar floor elevator was jammed. Anyway, it might make sense if the hangar had a vertical elevator floor/shaft that went down and then opens up more toward the front of the Nebulon-B (deep inside the superstructure).
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Driftwood
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Post by Driftwood » Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:32 am

Wouldn't the most sensible thing be to add a modular docking bay between the engines and the fore of the ship hanging down from the spar to resolve the technical issues?

Obviously extensive ship modifications, especially for the rebels is entirely viable and extremely common.

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Post by keiranhalcyon7 » Sat Aug 11, 2018 5:18 am

So, like, a modified frigate? :-)

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Post by DTM » Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:36 am

Get a look at this site to check possible hangar dimension:

https://www.siriusreplicas.com/models/s ... ulon-b.htm

I think Nebulon B Is not able to host more than 3 starfighters. As sed, they also need space for working around.
Personally, I like the idea of an added hangar module. I've got something in mind...

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Post by keiranhalcyon7 » Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:09 am

Come on, I could totally fit a fourth X-Wing in there. :-)

Or like, a dozen A-Wings. :D

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Post by Vince T » Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:29 am

Better stack up on those things' insurance then, you're gonna need it once pilots bump into each other while trying to find a free parking slot :D
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Post by Phoenix Leader » Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:33 am

I thought tractor beam assisted landing accurate enough to avoid any collisions.

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Post by Epsilon Eridani » Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:59 am

Bman wrote:
Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:19 am
Probably not cannon, but I think I remember in one of the Jedi Knight games (Jedi Outcast), wasn't there a mission where the hangar of a Nebulon-B had a basement hangar, and you had to confront pirates who hijacked the ship? The hangar floor elevator was jammed. Anyway, it might make sense if the hangar had a vertical elevator floor/shaft that went down and then opens up more toward the front of the Nebulon-B (deep inside the superstructure).
Jedi Outcast? Impossible, as far as I remember there are no Nebulon-B frigates in that game.

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Post by Phoenix Leader » Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:45 am

The Nebulon-B frigate from Armada doesn't have the hangar, though the Yavaris is powerful when used with Y-Wings or B-Wings.

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Post by Rich C » Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:22 pm

Driftwood wrote:
Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:32 am
Wouldn't the most sensible thing be to add a modular docking bay between the engines and the fore of the ship hanging down from the spar to resolve the technical issues?

Obviously extensive ship modifications, especially for the rebels is entirely viable and extremely common.
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Post by The Saxman » Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:42 pm

Bman wrote:
Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:19 am
Probably not cannon, but I think I remember in one of the Jedi Knight games (Jedi Outcast), wasn't there a mission where the hangar of a Nebulon-B had a basement hangar, and you had to confront pirates who hijacked the ship? The hangar floor elevator was jammed. Anyway, it might make sense if the hangar had a vertical elevator floor/shaft that went down and then opens up more toward the front of the Nebulon-B (deep inside the superstructure).
Mysteries of the Sith had a level set aboard a Corvette...with a hangar. Which is even MORE ridiculous.

Though you MIGHT make it work by assuming it's not a CR90 at all, but a completely different class of ship with of superficially similar configuration about twice the length, while stretching the midships module down vertically about two or three times its standard height.

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Post by Vince T » Sat Aug 11, 2018 4:53 pm

Well that MotS corvette is drastically overscaled as is the case with many ingame environments. Going by the scale of the level the ship would probably be 3 or 4 times the scale of a normal Corvette.

Just look at games like SWTOR, pretty much everything in that game is around 200% its normal size
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Post by DTM » Sat Aug 11, 2018 10:22 pm

I worked around the Nebulon B model, to understand how the hangar can be made. I think I have found a solution that can please everyone:

Do you remember the hangar of the "Phoenix Home", the flagship of the Phoenix Squadron in the first episode of the second season of "Star Wars Rebels"? It is a "flight through" hangar.

Image

I have come to the conclusion that this type of hangar is the ideal solution to host the greater number of starfighters, even in a narrow ship like Nebulon B. This would also explain the canonical aspect of Nebulon B, which apparently does not have a hangar. As we can see in my drawings below, I have added to the XWA model a flight deck in the module under the central body. Inside the central body there is the maintenance hangar, on two levels. The fighters get dropped into the flight deck with an elevator.

Image

The flight deck is narrow, but the maintenance hangar is large enough to accommodate two side-by-side starfighters. At least 12 starfighters can be housed inside the maintenance hangar.

Image

The take-off is from the front. The hangar doors can be closed. In this way the aesthetics of Nebulon B is exactly what we all know.

Image

Landing takes place from the rear. Even in this case, everything can be closed by the hangar doors. Larger transports can enter the maintenance hangar through the horizontal door, positioned just before the entrance to the flight deck.


I'm going to add this hangar system to the XWAUP Nebulon B Frigate :D

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Driftwood
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Post by Driftwood » Sat Aug 11, 2018 10:35 pm

*slow clap* Brilliant.

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