Star Wars Episode IX: The Rise of Skywalker (Rants & spoilers)

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Re: Star Wars Episode IX: The Rise of Skywalker (Rants & spoilers)

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General_Trageton

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Post by General_Trageton » Fri May 01, 2020 9:20 am

I did liked it.

Of course you always run the risk of coming under the magical spell of influencers whose only purpose in life is hat on everything for their own personal fifteen minutes of fame. Dispicable people if you ask me.
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Mark_Farlander
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Post by Mark_Farlander » Fri May 01, 2020 1:43 pm

I didn't follow this topic too much before because I didn't want to be "spoiled". Episode IX is surely an overall better film than Episode VIII: Battle of Exegol is a balanced battle, though Sidious Reborn disabling Nebulon-B frigates with force lightning seems slightly excessive.
And at least there is an explanation why Rey is a Mary Sue.
I don't judge tactics. The Battle is the best and only Judge.

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General_Trageton

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Post by General_Trageton » Fri May 01, 2020 3:33 pm

Well in Legends he created a Force-Storm-Wormhole-thingie that could swallow entire fleets and nobody complained :D
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Post by GavUK » Sat May 02, 2020 1:22 pm

Tuskin wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 2:55 am
Did anyone here actually say TROS is good?
I did after I saw it in December, but over the last few months, and especially after I saw it the second time last week, I hate it now.
You have to watch it more than once to truly appreciate how bad it is... when you see it the first time... most people have their 'rose tinted lightsabers' on... I experienced that effect when I saw Force Awakens the first time.

As soon as you start to delve into everything about a movie... so that includes, the lighting and art direction, the cgi, the musical scoring along with the plot, writing, direction and acting... You see through all of the fluff and realise there's nothing of any value there.

I see this trilogy in much the same as I do movies like the Fast & Furious franchise... utter shite movies but people still flock to see them... and each one gets more and more ridiculous as they try to up the action and stunts each time.

But as I've said before... Rogue One and Solo were actually great movies and I've got a whole new perspective on the prequels now... but if all you want is whooshy, spacey explosions and lightsaber fights and don't care about plots, directing and acting.. then yeah... I can understand how people would like them and I can understand how the very young will actually love them. But as a cinephile who delves into the depths of movies... there's not really much of any worth in there at all... perhaps some positives from the cgi, the score and the art direction... but those things do not make a movie good, let alone great... You have your opinion and I don't have to respect that or consider it worth listening too... and neither do you mine. But I'm never going to try and placate people by validating an opinion I consider wrong and am willing to back up with factual observations.

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Post by GavUK » Sat May 02, 2020 1:26 pm

General_Trageton wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 9:20 am
I did liked it.

Of course you always run the risk of coming under the magical spell of influencers whose only purpose in life is hat on everything for their own personal fifteen minutes of fame. Dispicable people if you ask me.
You see that there is a perfect example.. of why I consider your opinion irrelevant. You're not interested in an opposing view of things you like... they're all just haters in your mind.

I tried to respect your opinion, and I tried to give mine... but you're blind to anything outside of your narrow point of view on this particular subject.

That actually makes you the despicable person in this case... I wash my hands of you... please don't even bother to respond to me again with more of this drivel. I'm not interested in trying to have a conversation/debate with some one so narrow minded as to call people despicable for not liking the same things as you... Go away.

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Post by DarHan » Sat May 02, 2020 2:25 pm

My favorite part of online debates is how often people think opinions demand debates.

And how often the same people think they’re first in line (or the only person in line) to debate you, and not something like 403rd in line or more.
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General_Trageton

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Post by General_Trageton » Sat May 02, 2020 2:27 pm

GavUK wrote:
Sat May 02, 2020 1:26 pm
General_Trageton wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 9:20 am
...
You see that there is a perfect example.. of why I consider your opinion irrelevant. You're not interested in an opposing view of things you like... they're all just haters in your mind.

I tried to respect your opinion, and I tried to give mine... but you're blind to anything outside of your narrow point of view on this particular subject.

That actually makes you the despicable person in this case... I wash my hands of you... please don't even bother to respond to me again with more of this drivel. I'm not interested in trying to have a conversation/debate with some one so narrow minded as to call people despicable for not liking the same things as you... Go away.
OK I think we have a misunderstanding here. I'm sorry about that. I wasn't refering to you or anyone in this thread with that comment, apologies if it came across that way.

I absolutely respect the opinnion of others and if they don't like the movies that's their prorogative. To each their own. My remark was rather motivated by and directed at a whole of said influencers, streamers whose only contribution to the debate is yet another video or blogpost entitled with "everything bad about XY" or "why XY sucks", in which they present their personal oppinion as hard fact. It's these people that annoy me and who I hold responsible for a lot of the hate going around towards any item of popculture you might pick.

That being said, I find your reaction unwarranted and highly hurtful, even given the misunderstanding. While I merely voiced complaints about the culture of influencing and oppinion manipulation you attacked and insulted me directly.
Your ship, Captain. I need a drink. - Vince Trageton
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Driftwood

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Post by Driftwood » Sat May 02, 2020 3:21 pm

General_Trageton wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 3:33 pm
Well in Legends he created a Force-Storm-Wormhole-thingie that could swallow entire fleets and nobody complained :D
Yeah... as much as I like the old legends over the new canon that is mostly trash thus far, there really were some good series with awful plots and writing that were equally bad. I've been listening my way through the old audio books and the really early comic book adaptations with perhaps the exception of Crimson Empire and Dark Forces ones in particular were awfully rough in regards to dialogue and plot sequences. While one could theoretically argue that NuCanon is suffering similarly, I would disagree from the same angle purely because of how well established Star Wars background, and authors are now; even though the details have changed it should not be suffering similarly to the early writing post OT production. The major issues stem from Kathleen Kennedy's personal politics and direction she has been taking LA as a company, interestingly enough it's starting to come out that Disney as a whole is not happy with her or Bob Iger's decision making process that is resulting in the direction it has headed, and the backlash that has come from the fanbase as a result if anything simply because they are losing money on what should have been a "sure thing" for profit margins based off of financial trends pre-Disney takeover. Even if they share some of the political views and likely don't care or have any investment about the "Story" of Star Wars itself, the Disney execs DO care about losing money and consistently bad press from the element of the fanbase that matters most "the Hardcore Fans" who make up a majority of the merch sales and movie passes. I think this shows with the change in leadership that has started to take place since what has been happening isn't working for "them" and they are realizing something has to change before they lose more money. This is also why many of the shows they were planning keep getting cancelled, they probably rightfully believe they're going to lose money on the projects at this point and don't want to take any financial risks at this particular time.

Our spoken and personally held opinions don't matter in regards to Disney, LA, or anybody else; our personally held money does. In regards to our "peers", our opinions only matter to the point of constructive discourse and generally they are entirely subjective to our tastes. Lets not forget, writing movies and music is all art and art is subjective to the individual in a very large sense. Even when something is objectively bad, there's still a market for somebody who finds it appealing.

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Post by theonegalen » Sat Jul 11, 2020 7:32 am

I certainly don't mind Kennedy's political views. I'd love to see inclusive Star Wars - majority characters of color, feminist heroes, LGBTQ representation. I think that's a good thing.

But you gotta make a good movie first and foremost. While I love TLJ on it's own merits, it doesn't fit into JJ's concept of a sequel trilogy - I wouldn't call it a perfect movie at all, but I find it great, and heads and shoulders above the rest of the ST. TROS I find to be the absolute nadir (lowest point) of Star Wars filmmaking, and TFA wasn't much better. TROS was so bad that it retroactively makes TLJ worse by fumbling and trying to undo all the plot and character threads of the previous movie, an "accomplishment" beyond even the worst of the prequels. Imagine if ROTJ had fumbled the OT as bad as TROS. Imagine Tarkin coming back to be the bad guy. Imagine Vader not being Luke's father and Han Solo having been rescued in between films (going back on the previous film), and Leia suddenly obsessed with being in a romance with Luke, being reduced to screaming his name throughout the film (see: Finn in ROTS).

My tier list, because no one asked:

S-Rank: ESB, ANH
A-Rank: Rogue One, TLJ (A+)
B-Rank: ROTJ, Solo
C-Rank: ROTS
D-Rank: TPM, AOTC, TFA
F-Rank: TROS

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